OutFoxed Ep. 5 - Adam Goldfarb-1
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[00:00:00] James: This is OutFoxed, the podcast brought to you by Hunter io. Get ready for no playbooks, no posturing, and no ego. This is the podcast for the builders, not the theorists. I'm your co-host, James Nelson, joined by Hunter, CEO and OutFoxed co-host Matt Tha. And this is Adam gba. Welcome to the show, Adam. Thanks for having me.
[00:00:20] We're really excited to talk to you today, Adam. But before we get into all of that, could you just tell us a bit more about your background?
[00:00:26] Adam: Certainly. So after a pretty extended academic journey, I've been working in the medical assessment industry servicing auto insurers for the past 17 years. So initially my roles and responsibilities were more in the clinical realm and then eventually start to move into business operations and strategy, finance, account management.
[00:00:51] I felt that. A few years ago, it would probably be beneficial for me to get some formalized business training outside of just regular [00:01:00] day-to-day experiences. A few years ago, I enrolled in an executive MBA program at IB Business School. Incredible experience. So obviously the expected outcomes of that were the, the learnings from the curriculum expanded network.
[00:01:16] But one of the real tangible benefits for me was developing increased capacity because you're doing this program while you're working full-time and balancing family life. So you're creating hours that weren't there previously. So once the program is completed, I find I have these unfulfilled hours. My, my full-time job is great.
[00:01:38] So I'm thinking, well, what can I do to fulfill this time that I've created through the program? So it was at that time that I decided to pursue strategic consulting. In an industry that I've been very passionate about for probably 25 years, and that is high-end audio. This is an industry that is not [00:02:00] very well known in popular culture.
[00:02:02] Um, so basically there are companies all over the world that are manufacturing very complex, low volume, oftentimes extraordinarily expensive audio components for this very small subset of consumers that are looking to recreate the musical event in their home to deepen their connection to the music. So I saw that there is an opportunity there to be a consultant for these many, many organizations, and that's what I've been involved in for the last year and a half.
[00:02:36] Matt: That's very interesting. Okay. Can you further define high-end audio for people who may not fully understand like what you're really talking about there?
[00:02:47] Adam: So when you think about your smartphone, your smartphone has an audio system in it. Mm-hmm. So think about taking your smartphone and breaking it out into all these individual components that amplifier the streamer, the speakers, and [00:03:00] just multiply that by a thousand.
[00:03:01] So you're already these speakers, huge amplifiers, separate power supplies, lots of cables, lots of accessories, and these changes to your system that you don't think would make a difference that defy conventional reasoning actually do make a difference. It's not explainable, but all these little things do make an impact on the silent performance and do change your experience.
[00:03:24] It's really, really interesting to have a, a really deep connection to music. So you're, you're a
[00:03:30] Matt: pro $300 cables.
[00:03:35] Adam: I'm going, okay, so this is what I'm gonna say to you. Okay. Okay. If I was to tell you two eight foot speaker cables cost $30,000. I'm talking, you would have about 45 options there. Wow. So they're extraordinarily expensive.
[00:03:52] I, I can't explain the materials, the design. Um, they're, it's actually extraordinarily expensive, [00:04:00] how high the cables could be. So $300 is like entry level.
[00:04:04] Matt: They're high end.
[00:04:06] Adam: So my
[00:04:06] Matt: absurd example is absurd in the opposite direction of what I meant. Yes. That puts it into perspective. So, okay, you've listened to $30,000 audio cables.
[00:04:18] Do you hear the difference? So
[00:04:20] Adam: I've upgraded my, I don't have 30,000 cables. That's example. But let's say I've upgraded my keyboards about seven times. Okay. The differences aren't small. It's noticeable. Wow. And so if I bring my wife into the room and I show her an audio related upgrade. And she'll say, yeah, this is silly, but I do actually hear a difference.
[00:04:38] So it's, it's not just for, for things like me. Okay. That's good to know.
[00:04:44] James: How did you, how did you, like, how did this become a passion for you,
[00:04:48] Adam: Adam? I've always been very, very passionate about music. I don't play an instrument. I just love listening to music. And I decided, it was 26 years ago, I decided to, I wanted to upgrade my [00:05:00] speakers and the high-end audio store recommended that I get a new CD player.
[00:05:04] I was like, what are you talking, why a CD player? So I took his advice. He was a single disc CD player, had five buttons on it. It was $700 in 1999. And then I put that into my system and I heard recordings that I had heard, hundreds if not thousands of times. There were details in merging that I had never heard before, and it just catapulted from there.
[00:05:28] Wow.
[00:05:28] Matt: Do you have a go-to reference song for evaluating audio equipment? Several. Several? Okay.
[00:05:36] Adam: Yeah. But, um, I'm not, I'm more into the music as opposed to the pristine recordings for, I'd love some bands that have terrible recordings, but it's, the music is outstanding. It'll still be a go-to for me.
[00:05:48] Matt: So what's the first one when you're like, okay, I gotta hear, you know, you're, you got the set, you, you got new speakers, you're in the, you're in the audio store.
[00:05:56] In the audio room. You're like, okay, I need to bring this [00:06:00] music with me. What's the like first song you like?
[00:06:03] Adam: So there there'll be a couple of tracks off a particular radio head album that I'll put on that, that usually works for me.
[00:06:10] Matt: Okay. That's good. Mine's Bonnie Vere's Blood Bank.
[00:06:14] Adam: Oh, I love Bonnie Veer.
[00:06:16] Matt: Like I can hear things in blood bank that I don't hear, like you can listen on certain speakers and certain systems and there's almost always. Some element of the song that I haven't heard regularly through my Bluetooth headphones. That's like, it's just a privilege to hear there's something in that music I haven't heard before or not read, not regularly anyway.
[00:06:35] Absolutely. There's a
[00:06:36] Adam: lot of layers of Bonnie Bear. Love it. Yeah, that's a good one.
[00:06:38] James: And might be Wild Horses, uh, by The Stones. I've really gone into some lately and I think when you, when you listen to a high quality version of the recording, it's, yeah, I, I can kinda see where you come from, Adam. It makes such a difference when you can hear these tiny little elements that you wouldn't normally be able to get to if you didn't have, uh, you know, a good quality, [00:07:00] um, version of it.
[00:07:01] It's, yeah, it makes a world of difference. How, for sure. I, I've gotta ask, how, uh, how does someone who has, you know, a background in, in sort of strategy and operations, um, how does someone like that find themselves? Essentially, uh, selling to audio files, that's such a, that's such a 180 in terms of, of kind of what your background is and what your academical, uh, history is.
[00:07:29] How did you get into that?
[00:07:30] Adam: I find that a lot of the founders and chief designers of these audio companies are great engineers. There are very, they're very passionately about music, but they don't have that business experience. They may have had success based on spring to their products. My role will be to see how they can take that differentiator, take that value proposition, and then make the most of it.
[00:07:51] So that's where I saw the opportunity is that they may not have that business experience. They have the passion. So I feel like I am someone that could [00:08:00] combine both of those.
[00:08:01] Matt: It feels like that's probably a fairly common problem in that space, right? Like I've seen lots of really interesting audio brands pop up and then never heard from them again, or never seen those products again.
[00:08:13] Like this is this. I, is that just my own experience or do you find that this is actually kind of true across that, like frequently this is a problem in that space?
[00:08:20] Adam: It is, it is absolutely a real problem. It's also a problem that it is a contracting industry. Mm. So,
[00:08:26] Matt: mm-hmm.
[00:08:26] Adam: How many people under the age of 35 have sat in front of a stereo system?
[00:08:30] Their only experiences portable music for the most part. So, um, trying to, to get the luxury market to be aware of these products is def there's definitely opportunity there, but there's a lot of instability there. And it's, it's not, as I said, it is contracting. With the recent sort of macroeconomic changes, it's been further challenging for, for the audio industry for sure.
[00:08:52] Matt: Have the convenience oriented product lines out there. So like the Apple AirPods for example. You know, like we've, we've had [00:09:00] I think from an audio, not audio file perspective, but just an audio lover's perspective, like the convenience aspect of audio products has just gotten better and better and more plentiful, but.
[00:09:13] I know there's a trade off with the fidelity, so ha. Have they gotten to a point where fidelity and convenience can coexist well or is there still a divide?
[00:09:25] Adam: It has gotten be so, it has gotten better. So vinyl magnetic tape, pure analog signals are the best sound, but digital has gotten much better and streaming has gotten much better.
[00:09:38] So that convenience in that sonic quality are definitely merging at a much better extent than there used to be, for sure.
[00:09:46] Matt: Interesting. I want to go back one more time before we get into the first segment, James. So I have one more question here. I have to ask it so early and, and the reason I say this is 'cause I think for our audience, for, for Hunter [00:10:00] users, for, for listeners, hopefully of, of OutFoxed, you said something earlier that, that was really interesting.
[00:10:05] You said, um, you created capacity. Those hours existed though, right? You just somehow figured out how to con configure your life in a way that those hours, you were able to use those differently. So like, can we talk, can you elaborate on that? Like what were you doing with those hours before? Because I think for a lot of people who were thinking of side projects or entrepreneurial projects, this is really, really relevant and I don't think it gets talked about as well as some of the other more technical aspects of this.
[00:10:36] Do you mind going into that a bit? Of course.
[00:10:38] Adam: So obviously I can say developed efficiencies, that's not very informative. So with, with my day job knowing that, you know, I, I took control over a lot of things, starting to delegate, educate other people, and then you're empowering those people to take on additional responsibilities.
[00:10:53] That's one of the ways that you create additional capacity. And then we all are sometimes prone to [00:11:00] scheduling errors, sometimes procrastination creeps in the here and there and just recognizing just. You have to have that continuous work ethic. And it's building up a resiliency as well in, in having increased stamina.
[00:11:12] That's also, you know, physiological components that also add to building that, that capacity that didn't exist before. So multifactorial, uh, I don't know if that I really drilled down on how I got there, but, um, yeah, it was, it was almost like what I described to my classmates is when the program was done, we're all looking forward to, but then it happens and you feel like an emptiness with exercise if you don't continue to use that capacity, it does dissipate.
[00:11:42] And I did recognize that. So that's why I want to drive ahead and make the most of what I had built up.
[00:11:47] Matt: So what's an example of something you were doing with those hours before you started your, uh, your MBA program?
[00:11:54] Adam: So, in, in the evenings, you know, I would, rather than having leisure [00:12:00] time, I would be reading the cases and doing the deliverables.
[00:12:04] I found that streaming television or even listening to music wasn't as fulfilling as what I was doing when I was actually accomplishing that level of work. Mm-hmm. So that's where I decided to develop the, the side business to feel productive and, and achieve something and, and make a difference with what I'm doing as opposed to leisure activity, which we have enough of regardless.
[00:12:23] So,
[00:12:24] Matt: okay. So you weren't like a competitive gamer. You were, uh, you weren't like a, a Twitch streamer previously? This was just, uh, okay. It was just life. Okay.
[00:12:34] James: Yes. I've gotta ask Adam, you mentioned a couple of times about the physiological element of kind of having the energy and being capable of having the, the means to build the capacity.
[00:12:46] And you've mentioned, uh, kind of exercise a little bit. I'm just gonna, just gonna ask how do you find yourself, um, balancing, you know, the day-to-day work that you are doing of alongside the [00:13:00] side work that you are doing? Does exercise come into play? Like how do you recharge your batteries to keep yourself ready for the next day?
[00:13:08] Adam: So I, I wake up at 4:30 AM six days a week so that I do get in the exercise. Nothing will go right unless I get the exercise in, first thing in the morning. So that, that is something that's been a part of my life for about 10 years. And the benefits are so widespread that it's, it's, there's no flexibility when it comes to that.
[00:13:30] Matt: I hear that a lot. I, I, I hear almost everybody where you're like, what's the secret? It starts with, well, I get up before the sun so that I can exercise. And that's, uh, I'll say, that's a pattern that, that seems like, uh, yeah, that's been proven. That's great.
[00:13:45] Adam: Okay. If you like the after work late afternoon, there's too many things in the day that can derail you and prevent that from happening.
[00:13:51] So when you do it, first thing you know, it's, there's a better likelihood of it occurring.
[00:13:55] Matt: That's, yeah, that makes sense. There you go, James.
[00:13:58] Adam: Well,
[00:13:59] James: that's good to know. [00:14:00]
[00:14:00] Matt: Now I know the secret.
[00:14:02] James: Yeah, I just wrote that down. Um, thank you Matt. So, so Adam, uh, this podcast, we, we approach it really in a way that like we, we wanna have segments and we wanna make sure that we give people enough time to be able to really talk about what it is that goes into building something.
[00:14:19] I don't think a lot of that is done on podcasts like this. Um, and that's why we really wanna focus on it. So I'm just gonna rattle off a couple of different, uh, questions to you about kind of the journey that you've gone through. We would love to hear the reality of what that, that has meant, not necessarily the, the fluffiness that I think, um, we typically would hear from, you know, from, from different podcasts.
[00:14:43] So the first, and, uh, you know, the first and foremost things to ask you really is all about your ideal customers. And, you know, how did you go about finding your ideal buyer?
[00:14:55] Adam: So. Basically I, I found that my ideal customer is sort of in two [00:15:00] different buckets. Both of them will need to have sort of a pretty identifiable differentiator or value proposition within their product portfolio.
[00:15:10] So if they're just making box speakers, like 500 other companies, that's not something that somebody g would be reaching out to. As far as the ideal company, it's either a new entrant that is looking to, to make an impact in the high-end audio community, or it's an established company, but not a very mature, large company.
[00:15:33] I see. The companies that I don't, haven't, had, haven't had success with are the, the larger companies that have multiple layers of ownership if they're in a part of conglomerates. Um, perhaps they have worked with consultants previously, um, or they have their own strategy lead within their own organization, but sort of one, one or two steps below that, you know, five to 20 employees, um, that have been around for a few years, but [00:16:00] definitely I've been in, based on my outreach.
[00:16:02] Then the less mature companies see to be sort of my more ideal customer.
[00:16:07] Matt: Did you get there through trial and error, or were you pretty clear about this profile from the beginning?
[00:16:12] Adam: It was indeed trial and error.
[00:16:13] Matt: Okay.
[00:16:14] Adam: Yes. So I, I probably sent out about between 250, 300 outreaches, so it'd be, and I keep data on that.
[00:16:23] So based on those findings, that's what I found.
[00:16:26] Matt: Okay. We'll play the terminology game later, but do you call this a target prospect? Do you call this your ideal, like your ICP, your ideal? Like, like what's the terminology you actually use for describing this kind of person or this kind of account?
[00:16:43] Adam: I, I don't have terminology association.
[00:16:45] I don't have
[00:16:46] Matt: term
[00:16:46] Adam: base yet.
[00:16:47] Matt: Okay. So then how do you go find solutions to help you, uh, help you find those folks?
[00:16:52] Adam: So I do either have some background knowledge of a good number of these companies. Um, [00:17:00] part of what, part of what I do every is seeing very current with what is happening this industry. And so, and if I see something industry, I, I just sort of have an instinct, like there may be an opportunity with this company here based on a review that I read based on an extended forum on, on an audio community forum that I've read about, um, based on some compelling enforcement that I've seen based on something I've seen at a trade show.
[00:17:26] Um, that's normally where I get my ideas of who I'm gonna be, um, drafting my outreach for.
[00:17:33] James: So something, uh, something Matt that we, you know, we talk about and hear about quite often is this idea of having, when you write your, your email to someone and reaching out to 'em, it's all about making sure that it's relevant.
[00:17:47] Right. And how do you know if it's relevant? Well, you need to do research to figure out the type of people to contact what you've just described there, Adam. I, that's, that is such a, it's a [00:18:00] refreshing thing to hear because it means that you're probably not going out of your way to jot down these names as you're going through publications or, or, you know, scrolling through the internet.
[00:18:10] But you're do, you're taking an action that you're doing probably day in, day out, and you're getting value out of it. And that research is typically what sets people apart in terms of their ability to be successful with, you know, the sort of thing that you're doing. How did you, um. I guess my question here, Adam, is how did you, did you just kind of stumble into that or did you think I need to research, uh, who I could sell to?
[00:18:34] What was the mentality behind what you described?
[00:18:38] Adam: My,
[00:18:38] James: the
[00:18:38] Adam: process that I'm using with, with my outreach is I'm trying to capture what, what is this company? I'm trying to demonstrate that I understand what this company represents, what they're trying to achieve, and it's almost like because of the era that we live in, I know we may touch on this later.
[00:18:57] I'm trying to draft an email or that are gonna [00:19:00] detect that I'm, I'm not using AI to aid in drafting this EO that I, I understand this industry. I understand what single-ended tri of amplifiers are all about. I understand you're trying to cater to, I understand what type of musical express you're trying to generate.
[00:19:17] That's basically the core of what I'm trying to. To, to come across in my messaging so that it'll resonate with them because it, it is a very small community that is very poorly understood by most people.
[00:19:29] Matt: So your first, like, one of the key things you're trying to make sure you establish is a certain amount of credibility, because I imagine Yeah.
[00:19:36] Okay. Because I imagine there's like, there's a certain amount of information that if you're deep in a particular space, and I think this is probably true everywhere, but like, it's almost like there's, there's something, there's one or two things that you know, you can say that are gonna establish your credibility to the reader so that anything you say after that has like, sort of a new gravity to it, is that perfectly got That's the idea.
[00:19:59] [00:20:00] Okay. And I assume that came to you the first time you tried it?
[00:20:03] Adam: Yes.
[00:20:03] Matt: Yeah.
[00:20:05] Adam: You know, because of my job title I, in my day job, I get a lot of outreach,
[00:20:11] Matt: right. And
[00:20:12] Adam: it go and it goes to my, my trash. But I still read it. I still investigate like, where did, where did they go wrong with this? And I try to learn from that.
[00:20:20] Although there's not often a lot of learnings that they say, Hey Adam, it looks like you really need a lot of assistance with your real estate portfolio. I'm like, no, that, that's, that's the example where it's just, it's just trash. That that is, that is junk mail basically.
[00:20:33] Matt: Yeah. The one that gets me is, uh, I know as CEO of an agency, you must be going through blah, blah, blah.
[00:20:41] And it's like, well, first off you telling me my title doesn't help. Second of all, I don't work at an agency. And third, that problem isn't even interesting. So like you've kind of failed on all fronts right out of the gate. I feel like, uh, that's actually more common than not. It sounds like your experience is similar one.
[00:20:57] Absolutely. Yeah. We've seen that in our [00:21:00] research. This is actually, we, we, we've looked at this from a data perspective, and this is most commonly the issue is that things just aren't relevant. Like Exactly. They spend so much time, I think, um, I spent, they, I mean like people who are trying to do outreach, spend a lot of time on the technical bits.
[00:21:16] And I don't think spend as much time doing what you talked about, which is like really getting to understand the industry to a degree where, you know, you can establish a credibility right away that's gonna allow you to have a different conversation. I think that's really, um, an interesting part of your story.
[00:21:31] I appreciate you sharing that.
[00:21:33] Adam: It's not efficient, but it's, it's effective.
[00:21:36] Matt: That's the key, right? Like you, that's the trade off there. There's a certain amount of efficiency, you know, you're gonna have to give up. And I'm, and I'm curious, like, have you figured out how to scale that or has what you've learned is what you've learned that you can't really scale?
[00:21:50] That?
[00:21:50] Adam: I feel like if I try to scale it, it'll diminish the effectiveness.
[00:21:54] Matt: Yeah. Do you write every outreach message by like, from scratch? Like, is this, is [00:22:00] this like bespoke each time?
[00:22:01] Adam: Yeah.
[00:22:02] Matt: Okay. '
[00:22:03] Adam: cause that, I mean that's, that's the nature of the audience. It's not like even two manufacturers within the same product line.
[00:22:11] Are it gonna be similar and have it be similar to a certain type of message. That's, that's how you need to try to make it. So,
[00:22:17] Matt: and that's partly 'cause I imagine you're trying to speak to the problem or the challenge that you, that you perceive that, that that business is having or that that brand is having, trying to do something which is never gonna be the same right.
[00:22:28] From company to company, is that right?
[00:22:30] Adam: I don't try to offer any insights to what I anticipate their challenges would be in too much detail. Um, because I, that could be an unfounded assumption. So I just wanna explain, you know, that I understand what they're trying to do in this. I'm a little bit more generic towards the end about what I do to see if that's spark the
[00:22:47] Matt: interest.
[00:22:48] Got it. So establishing correct. I'm, I'm, I'm like, in my brain, I'm like trying to like reverse engineer what an email from, from Adam would look like. I'm imagining. [00:23:00] Um, there's something really, really specific to them about what they're trying to accomplish. And then maybe is there a bit about what you've done for others?
[00:23:09] Is there, do you get into like a little bio
[00:23:11] Adam: that's interesting so that it's often recommended to have the anecdote. I, I don't think it'll land well. If I say I've worked with manufacturer X in increase their EBITDA by X percent, I don't think it's gonna land well because of how dissimilar all these companies are.
[00:23:28] Matt: Okay. They're not all running around with EBITDA problems that they're, that are top of mind. Right. Okay. And I imagine, so this is great. So we talked about this, um, recently. There was somebody who asked a question on one of our webinars and we kind of went into this a little bit, but like part of what you're revealing in this is that the audience, like you've said, like this is probably, they're very good engineers.
[00:23:52] They've probably developed a really good unique product with some sort of clear differentiator. And in doing that. Yeah. Also, [00:24:00] they've kind of also raised their hand and said, I'm also probably the person who's really good at this part of it. So if you speak to that for them, you're gonna create that credibility.
[00:24:08] Whereas if you tried to communicate with them like they were worried about revenue or like, like approach 'em like a normal CEO or founder you might miss. Is that, is that right? Yeah. Okay.
[00:24:20] James: What is great Adam, so far is that we, we've got a sense of how you have gone about taking what you've learned in the classroom, taking your day-to-day job, applying it to finding your ideal buyers, uh, your ideal customers, but that there's something here where, where I think that it's worth double clicking and then talking about kind of how you have gone from zero to whatever your client count is now.
[00:24:44] I think you've given us a strong sense that you're taking all of that and turning in into a very, um, a very clear and understandable strategy to do the outreach. Let's talk about the actual outreach. How have you gone about growing the business?
[00:24:59] Adam: So [00:25:00] it's, I, I touched on this a little bit earlier, so again, staying very current with the industry.
[00:25:05] So I do attend trade shows. I do networking, part of the Toronto Audio File Society. I'm reading the monthly audio publications cover to cover, and I'm pretty active on some, um, specific audio forms. And from there, that's where I am basically generating a list of potential manufacturers that I can reach out to.
[00:25:27] So that's, that's where the growth comes from. And then just tracking my follow ups and any leads that I've had. And I don't use any particular software for that. I have a very organized Excel document. Um, but that's basic, basically my approach to, to growing and obviously, um, referrals from any existing clients.
[00:25:47] Matt: You wanna tell the story of how you landed your first customer on, uh, for transcendence?
[00:25:52] Adam: So it, it was through, it was through cold email. Um, okay. Had a few back and forths. Did, did the pitch, sent out the [00:26:00] proposal? Nothing as far as the process, there's nothing too remarkable about how I landed. It was very, it was very early on in my outreach.
[00:26:10] It was a sole proprietor, it was very small company. So, um, it was a sort of a, a great way to get started in delivering, actually delivering the professional services for this company.
[00:26:21] Matt: Do you think it was an easier or harder experience than you anticipated It would be.
[00:26:25] Adam: It was harder in the sense that some of the, the expectations started to shift
[00:26:33] Matt: with
[00:26:33] Adam: in, in ways that I wasn't able to anticipate.
[00:26:35] So, um, that was the, the challenging aspect of it. Um, but as far as the selling piece, that, that went fairly seamlessly. The execution got a little bit tricky once I was. Um, in, in the engagement
[00:26:48] Matt: itself. See more about that. So like, you mean like transitioning from the sellings phase into like getting in there and figuring out how to actually, yeah.
[00:26:56] So like how did that not match what you'd [00:27:00] expect it to be?
[00:27:02] Adam: So it's, my sense was, you know, we we're, we're working on whatever needs to be working on, um, this particular line of business speakers and, and cables. And then all of a sudden it's like, I need to get into magazines and then get more reviews done.
[00:27:18] It's like, well that wasn't what was at Wind and Proposal. Um, you know, we've all talked about so free. But it was just, it was just a very sudden departure that I was not equipped for at the time. We did, we did, I did ex, you know, get us back on the, on the, our original path. Um, but that was, you know, part of some of the growing the new businesses.
[00:27:40] Clients don't always act predictably. And that was definitely a case of that. You mean that wasn't a one-off situation? So far has been a one-off. That was, that was a very swift warning for me that, um, things based can be going a great direction initially that all of a sudden, um, additional intervention is needed.[00:28:00]
[00:28:00] Matt: Well, I'm impressed that was a one-off that's, uh, you must have really defined, like redefined your process well to kind of keep, keep it more on guardrails. Is that, is that a fair, that that would be fair. That would be accurate. Okay.
[00:28:14] Zach: More scope.
[00:28:14] Matt: It only took you one. Well done.
[00:28:16] Zach: Yeah. Today's episode is brought to you by hunter.io, the B2B lead generation platform made for every professional, whether it's prospecting, fundraising, recruiting, link building, or just trying to connect with the right people.
[00:28:31] Hunter makes it easy. So, so
[00:28:35] James: Adam, in, in the, I'm really interested in, in sort of what your take is on this. One of the things that we, you know, we all hear about when founders grow and grow and grow is that they eventually have to kind of hand over the reins in terms of growing the business, growing revenue.
[00:28:52] Um, just if we could pretend for a second that, that that was something that you, you know, you were kind of contemplating. Would you [00:29:00] trust someone based on your approach, based on your kind of very customized research and, and outreach content? Would you trust anyone to do the outreach for you?
[00:29:10] Adam: I would need to pass that over to somebody that has been a lifelong audio file, such as myself.
[00:29:20] So I, when I, when I do consulting with these companies, they talk about working with marketing agencies and every single time they talk about, they do not understand what we are trying to do. They, they, they don't get it. So I wanna be someone that, that, that is representative of somebody who does get it.
[00:29:38] So if I was to. Get somebody else involved, they would, they would need to have a similar background as myself and similar passion for, for the, this line of businesses I do. So that would, that would be a necessary component.
[00:29:50] Matt: If you contrast that to other experiences that you have, do you think that's unique to the high-end audio [00:30:00] space, or do you think that that's actually more common?
[00:30:03] Um, than, than maybe I would've expected.
[00:30:06] Adam: There's something that's hard for people to process about the high-end audio space that I, I don't know. 'cause we all, everyone's heard of Ferrari, everyone's heard of Chanel and Rolex and I find that just this, this synergy among the equipments using speakers in Spanish.
[00:30:22] I think it's just really something that's unique and hard for other people to grasp when it comes to high end audio. I do think it is unique with that, within that industry as opposed to other industries.
[00:30:33] Matt: I mean there's probably other industries where. There's just a certain amount of geek that's required to just step foot into it, right?
[00:30:39] Like you're, I feel like high-end audio is a bit like that. Like there's a threshold and if you're not willing as a normal consumer to cross a certain threshold, it's not for you. Like,
[00:30:49] Adam: it's like it requires a really deep understanding and it's, in some ways it is worked. It's, yeah, if you throw money at it, you're not necessarily going to get good sound.
[00:30:59] That's another thing [00:31:00] if you, because everything is so revealing. If you don't take the time to set things up properly, it'll sound worse than the free earbuds you hear in the economy class.
[00:31:09] Matt: So this is probably something the average person has no understanding. Like gi, give us an example of something that you're talking about here where like the average iPod, iPhone, AirPod user has no idea that this is like a thing.
[00:31:23] Like, yeah, I'd love to hear you give an example of things that don't go well together that actually make this sound terrible.
[00:31:29] Adam: So if you buy a pair of speakers, let's see. Buying. $80,000 speakers. Sure. And they go 300 pounds each. And you put them up against the wall. Flat up against the wall. Okay. You are going to hear the base double back against the back wall.
[00:31:46] And I'll go here is distorted base overwhelming the rest of the music. So you think these speakers are super expensive, there's no way that they're going to sound poorly, they will sound intolerable if you don't [00:32:00] position them properly.
[00:32:01] Matt: And not even, you're not even talking about like the angles at this point.
[00:32:04] You're just talking about something basic. Like, don't set them against the wall. Don't put them in a corner. Like, yeah.
[00:32:09] Adam: So it, some people spend weeks sending out their speakers. That's, that is so that, you know, talk about a barrier to entry. There's that, it, it doesn't work. Um, so that's, that's what I, that's what I think is some nuanced about this industry.
[00:32:24] There's a lot to learn, a lot that is very fully understood.
[00:32:28] Matt: Interesting. The convenience aspect of this is wild. Like, you know, you think most people when they get, when they upgrade to like really, really good noise canceling headphones, they think like, this is a whole new world. They have no idea. Like they're, they're much closer to the OG AirPods or, you know, Airbus earbuds than they are to actually like high-end audio.
[00:32:50] Sound. Like that's, yeah. Interesting.
[00:32:54] Adam: I'm not, I'm not ob just in the sense that, you know, little portable speakers when I'm listening, they do sound good that [00:33:00] they communicate the songs. I hear everything Well, but when it comes to critical listening Yeah. That those aren't gonna do the same thing as o well system
[00:33:06] Matt: for sure.
[00:33:07] Yeah. And, and $30,000 cables.
[00:33:13] James: Speaking of, uh, a promo, Adam, what is a piece of feedback that you've received throughout your outreach process, good or bad, that has put you in good stead moving forward? So
[00:33:25] Adam: it, it sounds obvious, but when I get to. The, the stage of pitching. You know, there, there's kind of, some people are reluctant to get into the dollars and cents on that, on that initial call.
[00:33:37] And I've found getting some advice from someone who does enterprise sales, that getting to the specifics of fees in seeing if they're receptive to that, any adjustment to fees is very critical during that first pitch. You'll have a lot more success when you get to the proposal stage. So that was, it seems obvious, but it's easy to shy away from that, um, especially if you haven't had a lot of experience pitching.
[00:33:58] So that was [00:34:00] definitely a small bit of advice that I use a hundred percent of the time when, when I'm at the pitch stage.
[00:34:05] Matt: Do you consider yourself a salesperson?
[00:34:07] Adam: Okay, so you have your dated view of a salesperson who's banging down doors, always be closing, not taking no for answer, which, you know, that's a commission driven person.
[00:34:18] I certainly don't view myself in, in, in those terms, but as far as consulting, selling. You know, establishing relationships, developing solutions for customers. I do think of myself as a salesperson from that vantage point for sure.
[00:34:34] Matt: Okay. Yeah, that makes sense. I, I think it's interesting, like you, you referenced an enterprise salesperson, like they probably feel a bit the same way.
[00:34:44] Like their job is getting the right solution in front of the right buyer. Sales is just a process, but they don't think about themselves as this kind of, like, what's the, like death of a salesman, you know, archetype style, you know? Right. Yeah. [00:35:00] It's, uh, okay. So yes, you're a salesperson, but not in that sort of archetypal kind of way.
[00:35:05] Right? Yeah.
[00:35:07] James: How do you describe what you do to your, to your wife Adam, and to your friends and family? As far as the, the, the outreach or the
[00:35:15] Adam: consulting,
[00:35:16] James: the outreach element?
[00:35:18] Adam: Yeah. So much of what I've, I've described before, so during those hours when I'm, I'm. Looking to make, um, connections with companies.
[00:35:29] I do spend time, um, on the website, the, the tab on the website, which now says who we are or our story. That's a great place to start to start compiling information. Um, I start reading some of the reviews to see are there any common themes that the audio reviewers are saying? So just maybe I haven't mentioned this.
[00:35:48] Audio reviews are like high reviews. There's publications, they listen to an amplifier speaker, they give their thoughts on it. So are there sort of emerging themes, um, coming from those reviews that sort of [00:36:00] align the design philosophy of the company? And I start to use that as sort of a central point with my outreach and then making sure I'm finding the current decision makers so that the founder who are, who's the existing ownership.
[00:36:16] And once I have all that information, that's when I start to send the cold emails out in, in, in track. I am comes with that. So I think that's basically my process in a nutshell.
[00:36:28] Matt: I love how targeted, and I love how specific and detailed this is. It really highlights the depths and the extent that you can go to, to really Greek create a tailored pitch.
[00:36:41] Like the, you get lost in the terminology sometimes with folks, right? When we do this, they get so caught up in trying to be like, okay, well I've got this checklist. I read it on a blog, it says I'm supposed to do these things and I do these, this thing, right? I wrote the email. But there's something so like laser focused about what you are [00:37:00] talking about.
[00:37:00] Like if, if you were to think about this in terms of like percentages, so you take your whole process from when you start thinking about an account to the time that you actually do your outreach, what percentage of that time are you spending crafting the email?
[00:37:19] Adam: That's an excellent question. It's probably like 20%.
[00:37:22] Matt: Okay. And the other 80 is the research that goes into it.
[00:37:25] Adam: Yeah,
[00:37:26] Matt: yeah.
[00:37:27] Adam: Because they, 'cause you don't, it's been shown that if I, if I'm gonna write a very extensive email, my chances of them responding to it is minimized. So I, even though I'm trying to be very convincing me in my outreach, it still is only three or four sentences long.
[00:37:43] Matt: In that first email we talked about like your, like one of the goals is to establish credibility, right? Like that's clear. How many goals do you try to set
[00:37:53] Adam: for that email? That's a great question. After I've established credibility, well, [00:38:00] I guess with my closing sentence, I'm just describing that I've worked with other Highend organizations.
[00:38:05] Again, I don't use the anecdote and my signature has my website. So on my website I do have a few blog articles that mm-hmm. We've all go to and, and, and see, you know, some of the articles that are written that'll further will their interest in my services. So. Um, yeah, I guess the second objective is to generate that curiosity and interest to see what I offer, what I'm all about, and if there, there could be a potential fit there.
[00:38:31] Matt: I, what I like about this is like, I think so often people try to do too much with an email. They try to go for the whole close, right? They're like, they're, I'm gonna sum up my entire sales process in the first email and I'm gonna like, home run it. And like, you go very, you, you're doing a lot less than that.
[00:38:48] Like, you've like really narrowed down. Like that first email is really just kind of like an opening line to establish that credibility and see if there's even any, any interest at all. Um, first off, that [00:39:00] probably suggests your recipients, your, your contacts are probably not getting hammered with these, or you feel like you can distinguish yourself from those enough that, how does that pay off for you?
[00:39:10] Like that, like, I, I really want to understand that better.
[00:39:13] Adam: So to address your first question, I don't think they're getting hammered with these because. So many people are not aware that these companies exist. Um, so I am, I'm data oriented. So as far as success goes, basically roughly about 60% of my messages will not get responded to about 15%.
[00:39:37] They'll say that they're not interested, and about 20% will reply with interest. 10% get to the, a verbal pitch, and then 5% get to a proposal, which compared to what I'm reading in, in industry standards is, is fairly solid. Yeah, those are, yeah,
[00:39:59] Matt: those are good [00:40:00] numbers. Yeah. Yeah. But you're also not trying to scale it, right?
[00:40:05] Like you're not playing the numbers game, or at least the way you are playing the numbers game, you're dealing with much smaller numbers, and so you're being very precise with the, with what you do.
[00:40:13] Adam: Exactly.
[00:40:14] Matt: Yeah. Okay. Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. Well, I think that's transferable. What I see out there is there's a lot of talk, there's a lot of, um, information in the world.
[00:40:24] If you're trying to think about this as cold outreach, there's a lot that's gonna tell you about how to scale and what the ratios need to be, et cetera. And like what tech stack can help you drive hundreds of thousands of these. But there's certainly a relationship between the customer value and how much, and you know, how much you should be putting into the research phase.
[00:40:44] But I also think just in general, your numbers probably are more of an indicator of your process than your industry, um, because of what you're doing to make each one count. And I know, I think people are always in such a race to scale. I think you're a really good case study [00:41:00] for, uh, not being in such a rush to do that.
[00:41:03] Adam: Right.
[00:41:03] Matt: Thank you. Yeah, I like that. Sorry, I know that was a long-winded compliment really. Is, uh, I, there was gonna be a question, but I realize No, you're just like a really good example of what to do. I think more than anything I brought up Tech Stack. Do we want to, do we wanna talk about Tech Stack for a second?
[00:41:19] 'cause I think I know the answer already and I'm like, I'm really excited to have you actually say it out loud, Adam.
[00:41:23] Adam: Yeah, I would say I have a pretty minimalist approach to that. Um, my, I just have my, my email domain, my website, my email finder and electronic signature platform.
[00:41:37] Matt: That's great. So it's like spreadsheet, signature email finding, uh, do you use a CRM or is this all in a spreadsheet?
[00:41:45] Adam: It's all a spreadsheet,
[00:41:46] Matt: yeah. Love that. I love that email and a spreadsheet and the internet.
[00:41:52] James: Do you, do you have a, a pad of paper and a pen as well? I need to know,
[00:41:58] Adam: I, if I'm, if [00:42:00] I'm doing a pitch, I'll, I'll just drop down notes. I know some people do recordings. I just drop down notes when I'm, when I'm missing sound speed to try to see if we can work together. But, um, that's the only time. Okay.
[00:42:13] James: I, I, I just kind of got vibes that you have a mole skin and like you're making loads of notes.
[00:42:17] At least that's what I do. I'm just trying to find someone to relate to. Well, I love that you are so, you're so lean in your approach and that kind of more minimalist is, is probably a better way to put it. And that kind of mirrors your, your entire process, Adam. So I would normally ask our guests what would you recommend in terms of your tech stack, but I think I wanna flip that and say, what would you recommend people who potentially have too much tech and what's the benefit of, of reducing and simplifying to just the things you absolutely need?
[00:42:52] One of my
[00:42:53] Adam: programs that I, I'm finding I'm not getting utility, is just the electronic signature rate. It does definitely have [00:43:00] benefits, but I'm just finding, I don't have a high volume, so I'm not deriving a lot of benefits for that. I know people are, I guess, using AI to help. Author content or edit. I have philosophical objections against that just because, and it's not, it's not because of the way I, I draft emails.
[00:43:22] I just found since the dawn of ai, which we'll say in 2022 when everybody's had access to chat, GBT, when I'm reading posts on LinkedIn, I just found that people were losing their creative voice by relying on AI to draft things for them. And I, I think of writing as a craft and it can only evolve by reading and writing and editing and rereading and I don't even use it to, to edit, but I've created because I even find that kinda like your own unique voice.
[00:43:53] So, um, that, that's one of my recommendations is I, like I said, I try to draft [00:44:00] my emails so that the audience will think there's no way that this person used any type of assistance generate this message.
[00:44:07] Matt: Do you try to use AI at all for your research?
[00:44:10] Adam: Oh, I, I use it for inquiries all the time. I just, I feel like a lot of people do use it for writing, and that's one area where I will not use ai, but I do absolutely use it my day-to-day.
[00:44:20] Definitely. You
[00:44:21] Matt: are not anti ai, you're just anti AI when it comes to writing. A hundred percent that capture. Okay. Okay. I feel I've struggled with this personally, like I'm, I'm pro ai, although I often scratch my head about all of us in tech. Authoring our own demise. So gleefully, it's a struggle, uh, for me to figure out how to engage with the words the same way that you do when you are not using AI at all.
[00:44:49] Like there's just, I don't know if you've experienced this, but like I can write if the draft have AI do some sort of edit, and then there's just enough transformation that [00:45:00] it's not like I'm reading my own words anymore. It's like something happens and I, you know, maybe it's a loss of creative voice. I think you said that very well, but like, yeah, I've really struggled when it comes to writing.
[00:45:11] I find it's useful in other ways, but the writing piece, I, it's not that I'm against it. I don't have like a philosophical point of view more. It's just practical. I've struggled to get the same quality output out of it that I thought I would, frankly. Right. Do you check in on it periodically? Like, oh, is this model going to do a better job?
[00:45:30] Or did you like draw a philosophical line in the sand
[00:45:34] Adam: For now, I'm still making that stand. Yeah.
[00:45:36] Matt: Okay. So no matter how good it gets, but it's just a line.
[00:45:41] Adam: Right. I, I, I just, I, I wanna still develop that writing skills on my own. 'cause it's, it, it can, it can never be good enough. Right. So,
[00:45:50] Matt: well, the MIT research that came out recently, I think backs up your point earlier about the capacity, right.
[00:45:58] That it's a, like working out. [00:46:00] Um, if you allow it to atrophy it does. And, uh, I think there's a really strong argument. If it's a core part of what you do, you can't give too much over to ai. It feels not, not because of ai, just because of your own brain and that muscle atrophy, I think. Exactly. Yeah. So you've sold business through cold email.
[00:46:25] Have you bought anything from cold email?
[00:46:28] Adam: It's, it's interesting. I, I can't recall a recent cold email outside of someone reaching out about an employment opportunity that has really engaged me and prompted me to follow up.
[00:46:42] James: Okay. What was it about those emails that have disengaged you?
[00:46:48] Adam: Uh, a lot of it's just like outsourcing, hr, it, security, all these, it's just, it's just, or usually at least what I'm seeing is just mass campaigns that are [00:47:00] completely irrelevant to what I would need in my day to day.
[00:47:02] Matt: We've sort of taken up the mantle to. Evangelize segmentation, um, which is not something I anticipated we would end up being the sort of, uh, voice box for, but it does feel like that's what's happened. And I think it's largely 'cause that it echoes my own experience, which is that the vast majority of outreach I get doesn't have anything to do with me.
[00:47:22] Yeah. And so the only answer to that is just bad segmentation. Right. You just bad list creation in the first place. I have it on good authority. There's an app for that, but we'll talk about that another day. So you wouldn't ever classify any of the cold emails you've received as good. Like that was one of the key questions is like, what's a good cold email for you?
[00:47:43] But you've actually never received, you've never been on the receiving end?
[00:47:46] Adam: Not recently, no. And, and it's not without investigating them either. Right. Do you read almost all of them?
[00:47:54] Matt: Yeah.
[00:47:54] Adam: Yeah.
[00:47:55] James: Do you read all of them because of um, just wanting to investigate [00:48:00] the current, I guess the state of play with cold email or.
[00:48:03] And, or I should say, is it because you feel that you should be engaging with these cold emails because it's part of your, your role day to
[00:48:12] Adam: day? So I I, I would say if I wasn't involved in outreach myself, I would just empty the trash and that would be the end of it. It's, it's, it's for curiosity, investigative learning purposes that I, I do take the time to read them.
[00:48:26] Matt: You're really throwing off their metrics, especially if you ever read 'em twice. Like somebody is like pulling their hair out, trying to figure out why this Adam Guy keeps reading the email and not responding.
[00:48:39] Adam: I'm reading from the trash bin now, so maybe, yeah, the data's different from there. Or maybe
[00:48:44] Matt: not.
[00:48:44] No, no. Every open, every open gives them some sort of false hope.
[00:48:50] James: So you, you've told us, uh, why you wouldn't engage with those emails, Adam,
[00:48:56] Matt: but.
[00:48:57] James: We are interested to know, and I know our listeners [00:49:00] are, what do you consider a good cold email? When I get an
[00:49:04] Adam: email where
[00:49:04] James: someone
[00:49:05] Adam: understands the nuances of the business that I'm in and can identify what those potential needs are and how we can work together to be successful in, in what I do, that's, that's where it's going to work for me.
[00:49:20] When I, you know, when I see that it's like, not exactly what I do, but at least it's tailored and there is, there is that understanding of the industry and that, that, again, the challenges that we're encountering right now, that's where I'd be like, okay, but let's have a conversation.
[00:49:36] Matt: So somebody's demonstrating if somebody demonstrates for you a more consultative point of view where they're thinking about it, they're really, they're, they're trying to demonstrate understanding that's the thing for you that really stands out.
[00:49:49] So even if it's, 'cause you mentioned you try not to assume you know the problem. But I often feel like that's a good thing to do with Gold App email because it [00:50:00] establishes very quickly to the reader, if you have this problem, this is worth reading, you've gone the other direction. Do you, is that simply because like too often they're just wrong or you just find that that's not effective?
[00:50:14] Adam: It's both.
[00:50:15] Matt: Okay.
[00:50:16] Adam: Sometimes they're missing the mark, and sometimes it just sounds very, very generic. Like this could be said to anybody in any vice president role. So that's, that's where it comes from.
[00:50:27] Matt: Okay. So nuance is really key for you both on sending and receiving, like that's just an important thing.
[00:50:32] Okay. Do you think that that's because of you? Like do you think you are just someone who indexes strongly on, on nuance, or you think that that's like, like a really good practice in general?
[00:50:44] Adam: I think it's a, it's a good practice in general.
[00:50:46] Matt: Okay. Yeah. I was trying to think of a bad example. I actually couldn't come up with one.
[00:50:50] So it's uh, that's probably a good sign. Yeah. I'm trying to think of what, in our like nuance I feel like is James, I'm like, I, I'm like trying to think of nuance in our space. I feel like there's just none. [00:51:00] Like there's
[00:51:01] James: no, it, the fact that you, you, you are almost, um, anti worst practices. I know that means your best practice, but really, Ann, the way that you're describing your whole approach to cold email is so, it's, it's the antithesis of what most people do and that's why people consider cold email to be spam and Right.
[00:51:25] Yet, I don't think, I mean, I'll, I'll ask you this question, you know, for you to answer, Adam, do you think the cold email is spam? It all depends on
[00:51:37] Adam: what level of specificity is, is in the email. If, if it's, if it's just part of the campaign message. Sent out on mass then that categorically is spam.
[00:51:50] Matt: Spam is more a measure of quality and relevance than it is an invitation.
[00:51:58] Yeah. Like you, okay. [00:52:00] It's not as for you at least, 'cause I know there's obviously like Canada, US, we all have laws about this that try to outline it, but for you, it's not about whether you opted in or not and it's about whether or not it's relevant. Right?
[00:52:11] Adam: I guess I
[00:52:12] Matt: I don't define it in the traditional sense.
[00:52:15] Yeah, I don't either. But I think I'm, I'm, I actually think if, if you poses this question to almost anyone in the decision making capacity, I think they would answer very similarly. I'd be hard pressed, you really, it, you'd be hard pressed to convince me that there are a lot of decision makers running around out there in any business and feel that way.
[00:52:34] And I think the reason is is just like, first off, most cold email turns out to be spam because of how they did it, not because it was cold and. I think we're all in the business of making good decisions for our companies, and so when there's a certain responsibility, we kind of have to know what's going on out there, and if somebody can help, it's sort of our job to figure that out.
[00:52:55] So I, it's like, it's hard to talk about this at scale, like this, this is [00:53:00] going back to the scale thing, but it's like, I think that this is kind of the, the secret, the whole space. I don't yet know what the tipping point is, but there's obviously a tipping point where at a certain, there's a certain line that you cross where you're, you're better off not doing it.
[00:53:16] And I think everybody's in such a race to do more. They're not thinking as much about whether or not the thing they're doing in the first place should even be done at the, at the level, the quality that it's, that it's being done at. That's, um,
[00:53:27] Adam: yeah. It's if, if you're, you're sending an email and the result is that that email is a nuisance to the recipient, is that to me should be viewed as Spain.
[00:53:38] Matt: That that's the minimum amount of thought that one should put into an email. I think I would agree with that. It's like, is this a nuisance? 'cause that's like it never should be at a minimum. Yeah. That's, that's, uh, yeah. That's good.
[00:53:53] James: So Adam, if you had to give advice to anyone who is at the [00:54:00] beginning of their outreach journey about how to get started and, and to do outreach, would you consider the right way?
[00:54:09] What would that be?
[00:54:10] Adam: I wouldn't necessarily suggest my level of detail for all industries. Um, but I would expect, you know, sort of that milligram between what we were just describing before, that is a nuisance, obviously not nowhere close to, to that level. Um. But just, just to, to do the appropriate level of research to make sure that you are demonstrating some sort of value and knowledge and understanding.
[00:54:36] And, and it, it may not be as quick as, you know, a, a mass campaign, but to put a little bit of extra layer of time because in the end, your outcomes are gonna be better, even be saving more time that way by having a level of specificity and in detail. And in that initial outreach,
[00:54:52] Matt: is there a resource over the years that you've used, whether this was in the beginning, in the early days, or that you found later?
[00:54:58] Is there a resource that [00:55:00] you look back on and say, I probably got the most, that was the most, like, the most benefit to my current approach from that particular resource, a blog or a book or something?
[00:55:11] Adam: So I'm just looking over at my bookshelf. So the cold email manifesto, which I thought was very interesting.
[00:55:17] Mm-hmm. So that book actually closely mimicked, not mimicked. I mimicked the process. Already had that process in place for the most part, um, based on that book. And, um, the Consulting Bible is also an incredible book. So these books aren't, the consulting is about, you know, selling consulting is also a huge part of the business, so Right.
[00:55:39] Those two really stood out about in terms of practical application for, for outreach for
[00:55:45] James: sure. Adam, I, I, I feel like I need to ask this before we, we wrap up Today's episode, consulting is such a referral, network driven business model. I have not encountered a lot of consultants who are [00:56:00] doing what you are doing, and I think their reluctance probably is at one point was well founded.
[00:56:08] But you seem to have taken a very thoughtful approach to doing cold outreach. What would you say to anyone who's in your shoes as a, as a consultant, not just to anyone who might be doing Colorado outreach, but specifically consultants about considering this as a path to grow their business?
[00:56:28] Adam: Well, one thing that you need to establish as a consultant is you need to have that credibility.
[00:56:33] And so that is why, um, for my industry, I do have those articles listed or the, those blogs on my website to sort of lend some credibility that I, I do understand this industry and I do understand the challenges in the, the audience in the marketplace. That's definitely the first step. And then building on that credibility, starting to, you know, get involved with, um, online [00:57:00] publications, et cetera, I think that is critical rather than just, um, you know, throwing yourself out there without having some demonstrated knowledge that, that, or expertise, um, in the industry.
[00:57:12] For sure.
[00:57:13] Matt: Alright, my last question, this is gonna be, this is the tough one, but you wanna leave the audience. You've got, you've, you've shared a lot of great information. What if they're curious about high-end audio is the best entry point brain for them?
[00:57:28] Adam: I was actually anticipating this question. So here's, here's what I, here's what I recommend.
[00:57:34] So first of all, if you have a deep relationship with music, that's, that would be your starting point. 'cause I've, I've had, I have a dedicated room in my house and I love having guests come in and I say, what is it attract that you're familiar with? And I've, I've observed their reaction. Some people are like, okay, cool, I'm gonna go back to the coterie board.
[00:57:53] And other people are trans fit. So if you have a deep connection to music, what I [00:58:00] recommend is go to a local Hi-Fi store and it doesn't require a huge investment. Just listen to a small system. It'll listen to tracks that you are familiar with and sit in the right, in the, in the proper listening seat.
[00:58:14] And that will be an experience that you may not, it's, it's maybe something that you're not expecting as far as how that's gonna communicate your favorite tracks to you. You're not gonna get that at a big box store. It has to be at a local Hi-Fi store. Mm-hmm. Um, but that's, that is, and it, I'm gonna say it could be one of the most rewarding purchases you'll ever make if you are passionate about music.
[00:58:38] You dodged my
[00:58:39] Matt: question completely, but it was still good information.
[00:58:43] James: So Adam, where can our listeners learn more about you, um, and your, your business transcendence?
[00:58:50] Adam: So, um, my website is www.transcendenceaudio.com. Now, I chose a word that is very challenging to spell,
[00:58:59] Matt: unfortunately,
[00:58:59] Adam: but. [00:59:00] I came up with that name because I find listening to audio is a transcendent experience.
[00:59:05] So that's where that came from. Um, so that's where, that's where you can find me all one word, transcendent audio.com.
[00:59:12] Matt: I enjoyed the, the audio articles by the way. I did, uh, I did visit, uh, earlier before this and had a chance to read each one. I was a little disappointed. There weren't more. I was like, I wanted to go like way back in time and see, uh, what was maybe like an early inspiration.
[00:59:27] Do you have, um, do you have like another blog out there that you would also point us to?
[00:59:32] Adam: No, that, that's my only blog and I do recognize that and it needs, needs more articles to, oh, I was just excited. I was like, God, who was
[00:59:39] Matt: ready to go deep down the rabbit hole and, uh, so I was, I was very excited. I enjoyed what I read.
[00:59:44] Great to hear. Thank you. Well, thanks Adam. This was great. I've really enjoyed the conversation.
[00:59:49] Adam: I, I
[00:59:49] James: enjoyed speaking with both of you as well. Thank you, Adam. So that was Adam Goldfarb. This is out fast and we're out of time. Thanks Adam. Thank you. If you like what [01:00:00] you heard, please like, subscribe. Next thought even more of that outfoxed community by visiting www.outboxhunter.io.